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BBC Newsnight and BBC World News: Dalai Lama Talks to Yalda Hakim About the Response from Countries like Britain to Recent Pro-Democracy Protests in Hong Kong

Dec 18, 2014   13:30 IST 
India

In an interview for BBC Newsnight and BBC World News, the Dalai Lama talks to Yalda Hakim about the response from countries like Britain to recent pro-democracy protests in Hong Kong. During the interview, being broadcast today on BBC World News, he also reacts to being turned down by the Pope, and potentially being the last Dalai Lama.   

 

Yalda Hakim: We’re in Rome, and while you’re here you’ve asked to meet with the Pope but that was turned down. Why?

Dalai Lama: Please ask the Vatican administration!

 

YH: The Vatican says that it’s a delicate situation with China and for obvious reasons. How do you interpret these “obvious” reasons?

DL: It’s OK, quite often happens.

 

YH: What does “obvious reasons” mean?

DL: It’s about China of course, great nation, and economically also very important. So therefore, in the Pope’s case there are quite a number of Christians in China, like his recent visit to Korea, although a Buddhist country there are a large number of Christians there. I think his administration is thinking about a possible visit to China. 

 

YH:The pro-democracy demonstrations in Hong Kong have ended, and a group of British MPs were recently denied visas they were going there on a fact finding mission. Do you think Britain overall should take a tougher stance on China?

DL: China, economically, very much wants to join the mainstream of the world economy. They are most welcome. At the same time the free world has a moral responsibility to bring China into the mainstream of democracy. China’s own people also want that… so therefore I think the whole world’s future has to be freedom and democracy.  I think the free world has certain responsibilities to stand firm over democracy and the rule of law and the freedom of the press.

 

YH:But are you disappointed that countries like Britain didn’t take a tougher stance and speak up against China during these protests, when these students were seeking democracy?

DL: My English friend said they say the British government’s pocket is more or less empty, so it’s very important to them to have close links with China for money reasons. That’s also realistic. 

 

YH: Young people from all over the world have been going to the Middle East to fight alongside the so-called Islamic State, committing brutal acts. Have they gone beyond redemption?

DL: I think due to lack of a holistic view and also due to a lack of genuine faith about their religion – if they are genuine they must practise love, forgiveness.  They should not touch weapons.

 

YH:How do we regain these disaffected youth who use religion as a pretext to violence and killing?

DL: Once they reach that stage it’s quite difficult. Once human emotions become out of control there is no room to utilise human intelligence or reason.  It’s very difficult.  That’s why sometimes I really feel the generation of the Twentieth Century, we create a lot of problems. So now the generation of the Twenty First Century, let them solve these problems. Now is our time to relax and we have created sufficient problems for their work. 

 

YH: You were recently in America, again race relations have come at the forefront (of the political debate) with race riots, did you get a sense of the frustration there?

DL: Although I love America, a comparatively young nation, during Lincoln slave ceased, then Martin Luther King, civil rights, now today, Obama originally from Africa, he became president, the system in America, I think wonderful, still emotional level over long term habit, some kind of discrimination. We need more effort to reduce some kind of spontaneous reaction to things based on colour, similarly on basis of faith, special effort continuously, we should not take for granted that time passes and things change, that is not a solution, we need more effort

 

YH: You said you would be potentially the last Dalai Lama. So there won’t be a 15th Dalai Lama?

DL: That depends on the circumstances. Whether the institution of the Dalai Lama should continue or not is up to the Tibetan people.  My death may not come within the next year or two years. I think my death may come after 15 or 20 years, by then the circumstances is such that then is it no longer relevant, this institution? I’m not worried.

 

YH: There’s concern that the 15th may be controlled by China, for example, there is that concern out there.

DL: That I think is a political matter.  The Dalai Lama no longer has that political responsibility.  And anyway the Dalai Lama institution will cease one day. These man-made institutions will cease.

There is no guarantee some stupid Dalai Lama won’t come next, who will disgrace himself or herself. That would be very sad. So much better that a centuries old tradition should cease at the time of a quite popular Dalai Lama.

 

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